York Diamond 90 Gas Furnace - Blower runs - no heat with burner cover in place
I have a York Diamond 90 Gas furnace that was blowing continously with no heat. Following some advice from this forum, I took off the main cover, cycled the power, and observed that the initial small fan was starting, the ignitor would glow, gas would kick in for about 3-4 seconds, but no ignition would occur. It wouldn't cycle again but instead after a few minutes the main blower would come on and run continously. So I cycled the power and took off the small cover where the burners are to get a better look, cycled the power and to my surprise the cycle caused ignition as soon as the gas came on. I replaced the burner cover and the main cover and the furnace ran fine for a few minutes to bring up the temp. The next time it tried to light again, same problem and same solution, turn off power, remove burner cover, restart power and it immediatly lit and ran until the temp shut it off. Any ideas what might be going on? My intake vent seems clear (at least with outside visual inspection). Any advice would be much appreciated. Thanks. I am having the exact same problem. This appears to be a common problem with this furnace. I initially thought it was the the thermostat, but once replaced I had the same problem. Receiving ventilation-pilot turns on, furnace catches for 5 seconds then turns off. However, some times it works other times I wake up to a cold house. Please help! Sorry, I should have posted an update earlier. I finally got a local technician really experienced with York and he, working with York, decided the problem was simply that the air intake was not restrictive enough. Essentially, the intake pipe wasn't quite long enough (they recommend something like 20-25 feet minimum and mine was probably 20)and their was too much air coming in preventing the gas concentration from building up sufficiently to light. The solution was what I actually had been doing, loosen the viewport cover to let in extra air. He did it a little more elegantly by installing washers behind the screws to create a gap, but it was the same result. The other possible solutions were to drill holes in the burner box cover (didn't like that one) or add a slightly smaller diameter extension on the intake pipe to add air restriction. It is unclear why the problem arose after many years of working fine but apparently this was at least somewhat well known as a possible problem by the vendor as they suggested this solution. Since this change about 2 months now with no problem. Frankly, I don't like the solution of modifying the furnace. It should not be necessary. And I'd be very surprised if there is a 25 foot minimum length of vent pipe. A more likely cause of the problem is that the vent pipe is plugged up with a leaf that is impairing air flow to the furnace and causing the pressure switch to open, shutting off the burner. Do you have any bushes or trees near where the vent pipe terminates? The idea that there is too much air coming into the furnace is also bogus. By opening the burner compartment, you are flooding the combustion area with air ---- the furnace starts working because the pressure switch will stay closed because there is now adequate combustion air. It doesn't take much to cause a pressure switch to open --- a leaf will do it, even droplets of water condensing on the PVC pipe in cold weather can cause that in cold weather. I hear you on modifying the furnace, though given it came from York themselves, I do give it more credence. Here is one online reference to a minimum pipe length for York Furnaces: http://www.descoenergy.com/pdf/York%...%20Furnace.pdf I know it is not blocked because: 1. It was vacuumed thoroughly, twice. There are no bushes near the intake at all. 2. You can visible feel totally free air flow through the pipe with a vacuum/blower on one end and your hand over the nozzle. 3. The furnace was off all summer, and we had a summer with almost no rain, and the problem occured again first time I tried the furnace in late summer (on a warm day also) so I seriously doubt there was condensation. 4. The pressure switch was always closing correctly and staying closed. This was tested by the technician and visibly/audibly obvious because gas always flowed, the ignitor glowed just fine, it just never ignited. Opening up the chamber does allow air in, of course, but even more importantly I believe it keeps the air flow more uniform rather than one large shot from the intake blower. That is my theory at least. It is also possible the ignitor is slightly off position or something like that and the gas just wasn't making it across the chamber correctly but either way, the fix works. Originally Posted by formerag the ignitor glowed just fine, it just never ignited. All the safety switch prerequisites are met first, in order to get the ignitor to glow (including proper pressure through the switch, and also the switch has to be working in order for the glow to occur). The next stage is combustion. If no combustion; either you have a weak ignitor (yes, they can glow but still be too weak to fire up the gas), or an out of positon ignitor (from some previous install perhaps), or poor gas flow through valve, or something in the burners causing not enough gas to get to the ignitor quickly enough. (The ignitor will shut off about the same time ignition is to occur.) Open up the (big top) panel of the furnace to observe and listen. See if when the ignitor glows, that you hear a click in the gas valve. There should be this click, a split second before the ignitor shuts back down. -IF- no click (you can also FEEL for the click with your fingertips placed on the gas valve), then you MAY have bad ignition module. Let us know what you find so we can further advise. All right, I stand corrected by ecman51s comments. He's correct that the pressure switch has proved that the venting system is working and the pressure switch is staying closed. I'm not able to get the PDF on the furnace. Anyway, ecman51 has good suggestions on things to check. Same furnace, it was built in 1996. Thermostat is set at 70F. Heat comes on. Ignition light lights, burner burns, blower and fan come on. A minute later the burner turns off. The blower and the fan continue to run. Last night was a pretty cold night (Northern VA dropped to about 10F). Filter near furnace was really dusty, I had to clean some of the dust off, but didn't have a replacement filter (now I do but I am at work). It is propane ran. If you flip the power switch to the unit, it lights again, but continues the cycle posted. Taking off the burner cover doesn't seem to make a difference. It was recommended I replace the Honewell thermo (manual/mercury unit). I was going to do that when I get off work. The sensor that sits in the flame is fine. The only that that has changed with the unit is the outside temperature. Any other ideas? Originally Posted by diamond.g It was recommended I replace the Honewell thermo (manual/mercury unit). I was going to do that when I get off work. The sensor that sits in the flame is fine. The only that that has changed with the unit is the outside temperature. Any other ideas? UPDATE: House is 70єF. I got a Honeywell RTH7500D t-stat. I am going to replace the old t-stat and see if that helps the problem. It has something to do with how cold it has been getting for the past couple of days. I am hoping that the new t-stat will resolve the issue. I've been chasing the same problem as many others with a 1999 vintage York Diamond 90 heater (horizontal). I have followed some of the same advice provided by others. My system will allow blower to start, then igniter to light, then gas valve opens, and burner is ignited, the igniter is then extinguished. The main fan then starts and the entire system is “A-OKAY”. However, some time later the flame is extinguished, and the fan continue to blow cold air. The timing of this shut down varies. I have an error code of four flashes which indicates a “bad” open limit switch. Tests have confirmed the upper limit switch is bad. It allows contact at first startup but after about one minute it will open and kills the rest of the circuit. A jumper wire across the terminals (as suggested by your forum) seems to defeat this, and the system will run for a longer time - but eventually stops as described about. I have checked all of the other limit switches and they seem to function properly. I have also tried “testing” the two (pressure) switches by removing the connecting hoses – the system will immediately “flame out’. I assume this means they are working. I have tried cleaning the flame sensor. It did not appear badly coated. Perhaps I should still replace it. But the error message of four flashes still suggests the limit switch. In further reading of the forum relating to length of intake pipe, it occurs that I have been trying to run the system with the flame compartment door removed. (this allows easy sight to the burner vision glass). Could this be a problem? I am also not sure if the system is so sensitive that having blocked up one supply register could cause a problem. I also read that some felt the return air filter or other system restriction could cause a problem. I have not resolved any of these possibilities. I did order a replacement circuit panel from Source 1. However, this was not the proper White-Rogers replacement panel and I returned it immediately. I did not want the same problems as others on this forum. Unfortunately, it may still be a part of my problem. Can someone explain what the pressure switches do? Also, how can I test for water drain line blockage (could this be a part of the problem?) I don’t know what to try next. I would gladly hire any one of you who has had prior experience. However, I fear locally, I would be getting a repair person who doesn’t understand what you have all shared in your postings. If all of my limit switches (there are 3, and they do not have resets) are working or jumpered around, why am I still getting a 4 flash error message? Is it possible to still purchase the original White –Rogers circuit panel, if so from whom? What else can I try? Chilly-in-Chico Originally Posted by KMBORZAGE ... If all of my limit switches (there are 3, and they do not have resets) are working or jumpered around, why am I still getting a 4 flash error message?... Chilly-in-Chico I would caution you against operating a furnace for any length of time with any of the safety devices defeated. Sounds to me like your furnace is indeed cycling on a limit switch. The problem would not be the switch, it would be an overheating problem. This can be caused by a dirty air filter, dirty A coil (air-conditioner evaporator) or a restriction in your duct work. Is your return register blocked by a carpet or furniture? If you have checked all the above and your furnace is still locking out with a 4-flash code try kicking up your blower speed. That is assuming it is not already on high speed for heating. BTW: Here are the typical color codes for blower wiring. Black = High Speed Blue = Med High Speed Yellow = Med Low Speed Red = Low Speed White is neutral or common. Brown wires go to the capacitor. By the way looks like this is another case of more than problem on the same thread. I have some expertise with the newer York furnaces. If the original poster is still having a problem, send me a private message indicating your problem and what you have tried. I may be able to help. Originally Posted by xpogi By the way looks like this is another case of more than problem on the same thread. Yep. I'm just checking out when that happens. It's too confusing and the lack of continuity could even cause safety problems for people not getting the whole story. Originally Posted by SeattlePioneer Yep. I'm just checking out when that happens. It's too confusing and the lack of continuity could even cause safety problems for people not getting the whole story. You are absolutely right. I am sure the posters mean no harm, some boards seem to prefer fewer threads but in the case of this one some wrong (and potentially dangerous) information could be conveyed. Perhaps the moderators need to post a sticky. Originally Posted by diamond.g UPDATE: House is 70єF. I got a Honeywell RTH7500D t-stat. I am going to replace the old t-stat and see if that helps the problem. It has something to do with how cold it has been getting for the past couple of days. I am hoping that the new t-stat will resolve the issue. January must be Furnace problem month for me... Woke up to furnace blowing cool air. It was 14F outside (I really think it has something to do with the outside temp). After looking around on the forums I noticed people talking about clearing water out of some lines. Is it possible that the cold air is causing some water to freeze somewhere thereby killing the flame? I am once again at work, hopefully when I get home the heat will be back on. Okay, so my wife verified that the heat was working when she got home. This morning we woke up to the same thing. I am down near the unit I hear it turn on. Run for about 10 minutes, turn off and then repeat the cycle. So the sequence of events is as follows: -Set thermostat to 71 -fan turns on in furnace -after a minute of running the igniter lights -the burners get lit -the main blower turns on and the unit starts to (try to) heat the house -after about a minute of the flames being on the burner goes out -the blower continues to run for a while, eventually blowing cool air -blower shuts off and the cycle starts over again My main question is why does our furnace only do this when the temp is below 20єF or so. It has been working fine for the rest of winter. York Diamond 90 P2URD12N07501A Hmm it seems now it is actually trying to heat the house properly, sigh I wish I knew what was wrong with it. Diamond... No HVAC guy, but I think you are correct when you say it has something to do with outside temp. You posted that it is propane, correct? I think that may have gotten lost in all the mix of posts/problems. I'd seriously suggest you make a new post with your symptoms and what has been addressed. May also want to give size of propane tank and line feeding house or furnace. Starting a new thread is recommended, diamong g. I had the same intermittent problem. HVAC guy who fixed it said the igniter was too far from the burner and that this is a common problem after igniter replacement as people don't read the installation notes. In my previous post of 1/03/09 I express some of the same symptoms as others of you (Chilly-in-Chico). I took all of the good advice from others in this forum and learned more about my Diamond 90 system than I wanted. I eventually replaced both the flame sensor ($7) and the upper limit switch ($18), neither of which were probably responsible for my problem. I finally called my local Heating professional. For a service fee of $75 he spent about 2 hours retracing all of my own testing. In the end he suspects the problem is a poor wiring connection at the low voltage harness the attaches into the computer/circuit board. Thus far, the intermittent problem is fixed. There is more. Prior to my calling for professional help, I tried to order a new replacement for the original White-Rogers circuit board. Source1 sent a replacement that is totally different and would require understanding re-route all of the wiring. I returned it. The service pro said because the computer/circuit board is mounted directly to the fan housing there is un-dampened vibration. He believes this eventually develops into the break in the wiring harness housing. Sorry, I cannot add any details about what he actually did --- but for now it is working fine. Good luck to you all and thanks for the help! not Chilly-in-Chico Hello KNBO--- Your repairman is to be commended for his patience in tracking down the problem you describe. Bad wiring harnesses are the devil to diagnose. And $75 is a cheap fee to get that kind of problem diagnosed correctly the first time. 'Way too often a problem like that MIGHT be discovered only after several service calls and the replacement of several expensive parts--- and then the solution would often be to replace the furnace. I'm not at all sure I'd have done as well as your repairman. Was this an independent repairman or an employee in a bigger outfit? I'd be inclined to 1) keep this guys name on file and refer him out to other people who might need repairs on their furnace 2) send a note of commendation to his boss and 3) perhaps send him a gift certificate by way of saying thanks. Hi all, My problem is similar to the first problem described in this thread. York Diamond 90 furnace blowing cold air. From what can tell (see detailed description below), the burners are not getting lit, although they clearly were just a few hours ago. And I apologize in advance if I get any terminology wrong; please correct me if so. Background: I have only one gas appliance in the house: the furnace. So I bought this house in May, and just had the gas turned on last week (didn't need furnace before now!). I cannot check whether gas is still entering the house, aside from taking a look at the meter, which looks fine and is in the on position. There was obviously incoming gas this am, so I don't know what could have changed there. What is happening: This is about the third day I have used the furnace. It was blowing hot air this morning and then began blowing cold air midday. I went to the basement to watch it in action. The igniter begins to glow, glows steadily for a few seconds, then the glow goes dark slowly. It is then dark for about 25 seconds. Then the cycle repeats itself. It will continue to do this for as long as I have the thermostat set to a higher temperature than is the current temp in the house. The blower is going, as is the fan. However, I do not see any flames anywhere inside the burner box. What I have checked and tried: Vent pipes: There is no vent pipe connected to the intake; it just sucks inside air in from the basement. It is clear and I can put my hand over it and feel it sucking in air. The outgoing vent pipe looks fine; no obstructions. One post in this thread said that the air intake might need to be more restrictive. I tried restricting the flow with some thin fabric held over the intake. When I did that, the igniter turned off. So then I tried putting my hand just slightly over the intake. Again, the igniter seemed offended and turned off. Condensate pump: I don't think this is it. I installed a new condensate pump last week (the old one was falling apart), but I don't think the furnace has been operating long enough to generate enough condensate to trigger the thing. Error light: There is no error light at all. I watched it for several boring minutes. Air filter: Brand new and clean. Burner cover: I finally took off the burner cover and tried to see if the burners would ignite then. They didn't. The igniter just continued its usual 30-second on-off cycle. So.... From the other posts I have read here, it seems like there is something wrong with the igniter or with the gas supply entering the burner box. I would really like to try to fix this myself; I am fairly handy and find myself with more time than money these days (pretty common, I suppose!). What would be the best first step? Call the gas company about the possibility of poor gas flow? Replace the ignitor? Move the ignitor slightly? Do something with the burners (clean them or something)? Something else? Sorry for how long this post is and thanks in advance for your replies! I will be sure to get back instantly with answers to any questions. Trying to deal with multiple problems on the same thread rapidly becomes confusing. I'd like to suggest that you re post on a new thread. I will start a new thread right now. Thanks. Originally Posted by KMBORZAGE I've been chasing the same problem as many others with a 1999 vintage York Diamond 90 heater (horizontal). I have followed some of the same advice provided by others. My system will allow blower to start, then igniter to light, then gas valve opens, and burner is ignited, the igniter is then extinguished. The main fan then starts and the entire system is “A-OKAY”. However, some time later the flame is extinguished, and the fan continue to blow cold air. The timing of this shut down varies. I have an error code of four flashes which indicates a “bad” open limit switch. Tests have confirmed the upper limit switch is bad. It allows contact at first startup but after about one minute it will open and kills the rest of the circuit. A jumper wire across the terminals (as suggested by your forum) seems to defeat this, and the system will run for a longer time - but eventually stops as described about. I have checked all of the other limit switches and they seem to function properly. I have also tried “testing” the two (pressure) switches by removing the connecting hoses – the system will immediately “flame out’. I assume this means they are working. I have tried cleaning the flame sensor. It did not appear badly coated. Perhaps I should still replace it. But the error message of four flashes still suggests the limit switch. In further reading of the forum relating to length of intake pipe, it occurs that I have been trying to run the system with the flame compartment door removed. (this allows easy sight to the burner vision glass). Could this be a problem? I am also not sure if the system is so sensitive that having blocked up one supply register could cause a problem. I also read that some felt the return air filter or other system restriction could cause a problem. I have not resolved any of these possibilities. I did order a replacement circuit panel from Source 1. However, this was not the proper White-Rogers replacement panel and I returned it immediately. I did not want the same problems as others on this forum. Unfortunately, it may still be a part of my problem. Can someone explain what the pressure switches do? Also, how can I test for water drain line blockage (could this be a part of the problem?) I don’t know what to try next. I would gladly hire any one of you who has had prior experience. However, I fear locally, I would be getting a repair person who doesn’t understand what you have all shared in your postings. If all of my limit switches (there are 3, and they do not have resets) are working or jumpered around, why am I still getting a 4 flash error message? Is it possible to still purchase the original White –Rogers circuit panel, if so from whom? What else can I try? Chilly-in-Chico Cold in Baltimore, I have similar problems with my Diamond 90 furnace, gas fired. There are two things that I have just done to get my furnace back running. 1. I killed the power, removed the pressure switch with the 2 hoses connected and checked to see if water would drain out of the hose opening nearest the outside of the unit. A fair amount of water ran out. I did my best to removed all of the water, then reinstalled the switch. This is the second time that I have done so this heating season. I did it once last heating season too. 2. Because of #1 above, I felt that there was a condensation problem with my unit, so I removed the condensate collector part from the furnace and cleaned it thoroughly. This part is made from black plastic, is located in the bottom chamber just to the right of the control board, and has three hoses running from the upper chamber. The hoses route from the vent line, the combustion blower and the condensate chamber under the fire box. They drain out of this unit to the main condensate drain to my floor drain. I got a lot of water, sediment and mineral deposits out of it. Be sure to check the hoses to make sure that they are not clogged. My furnace is now working much better! Not Cold in Baltimore anymore. PS. I don't agree with all the talk about modifying the unit or that the inlet pipe may be the problem either. My unit has operate reliably for nine years without any inlet pipe attached. I only have an exhaust pipe on my furnace. That's how the builder installed the unit. Trying to deal with multiple problems on the same thread rapidly becomes confusing. I'd like to suggest that you re post on a new thread. Originally Posted by SeattlePioneer Trying to deal with multiple problems on the same thread rapidly becomes confusing. I'd like to suggest that you re post on a new thread. I disagree that the problem with my furnace is different than KMBORZAGES #10 thread post. My furnace was giving me a 4 flash error message just like his furnace. I have a York Gas-fired furnace Model # P3URD16N07501A. The symptoms are the same: “Both systems will allow the blower to start, then the igniter to light, then the gas valve opens, and the burner lites, the igniter is then extinguished. The main fan then starts and the entire system is “A-OKAY”. However, some time later the flame is extinguished, and the fan continues to blow cold air for awhile before it turns off. The timing of this shut down varies a bit.” I had this problem last winter and wound up calling in a heating professional. He and others I had talked with trying to get them to make a service call to my house on a Sunday suggested that the problem may be a dirty air filter, a bad thermostat, a bad control board, a clogged intake pipe or a clogged exhaust vent pipe. I paid a heating professional $75 to make a service call to my home the next morning. He eliminated the air filter, thermostat, clogged intake air pipe and exhaust air pipe as possible causes for my furnace malfunction. He didn’t think that I had a bad control board either. The mechanic removed the pressure switch for the burner box/ventor (1LP on the wiring diagram). He removed the hose on the ventor (combustion burner) side of the switch, turned it over and drained water from within this side of the pressure switch as I watched him work. He then reinstalled the pressure switch and fired up the furnace. The furnace ran as it should for the remainder of last winter. No more 4 flash error messages. Problem solved so I thought! About two weeks ago, the same problem reappeared with the furnace. So, I promptly removed the same pressure switch to check and see if there was water in the switch as last winter. Yes, it did have water in the switch, which I promptly drained. I reinstalled the switch and tested the furnace for normal operation. The furnace ran as it should. This worked for about a week and a half. Then on Sunday 01/03/10, the same problem appeared again; water in the pressure switch. I cleaned the switch again and reinstalled it and the furnace again ran as it should. Yesterday, I ran into a couple of HVAC mechanics, each with about 30 to 35 years of experience, and told them of the recurring problems with my furnace. They suggested that I check the condensate drain on my system and make sure that all the lines were clear and draining. Yesterday after work, I performed the following two things that I have just done to get my furnace back running. 1. I disconnected the power to the furnace, removed the pressure switch for the burner box and combustion blower and checked to see if water would drain out of the hose opening nearest the outside of the unit. A small amount of water ran out. I did my best to remove all of the water and then I reinstalled the switch. 2. Because I found water in the pressure switch in #1 above again, and with my discussion with the HVAC mechanics earlier in the day, I felt that there must be a condensation problem with my unit. I removed the plastic part that collects condensation from the furnace in three locations and drains it to the floor drain. This part is black in color and is located in the bottom chamber just to the right of the control board. It has three hoses running from the upper chamber. The hoses route from the exhaust vent line, the combustion blower and the condensate chamber under the fire box. They drain out of this unit to the main condensate drain and to my floor drain. I got a lot of water, sediment and mineral deposits out of this collector unit. I checked the hoses before and after this unit to make sure that they were not clogged either. My furnace is now working properly! When I got home from work today 01/05/10, I checked on the furnace and again I wanted to see if there was any water in the pressure switch for the burner box and combustion blower. When I removed the pressure switch and checked it for water inside, it was completely dry; no water. Finally, some good news! I do understand that you sometimes get some different problems listed on the same thread, but, in this case, feel that there are numerous culprits to this furnace malfunction. People need to understand that sometimes any of the parts listed above can cause their furnace to give a 4 flash error message. What fixes my furnace may not fix someone else’s. Remember to “think outside of the box” and “A parachute and a mind are only of any use if they remain open”. Not Cold in Baltimore anymore. Personally I find it distracting and difficult to try to deal with similar problems on the same thread. But if it floats your boat, help yourself. Originally Posted by SeattlePioneer Frankly, I don't like the solution of modifying the furnace. It should not be necessary. And I'd be very surprised if there is a 25 foot minimum length of vent pipe. A more likely cause of the problem is that the vent pipe is plugged up with a leaf that is impairing air flow to the furnace and causing the pressure switch to open, shutting off the burner. Do you have any bushes or trees near where the vent pipe terminates? The idea that there is too much air coming into the furnace is also bogus. By opening the burner compartment, you are flooding the combustion area with air ---- the furnace starts working because the pressure switch will stay closed because there is now adequate combustion air. It doesn't take much to cause a pressure switch to open --- a leaf will do it, even droplets of water condensing on the PVC pipe in cold weather can cause that in cold weather. SEATTLEPIONEER: Don't be hypocritical by trying to say that my comments should be in a new thread. It was your own comment in the quote above that said ...even droplets of water condensing on the PVC pipe in cold weather can cause that in cold weather. You sparked the thought for me that my furnace may have a condensation problem. By the way, taking a little time to check and ensure that there isn't a condensation problem in a furnace doesn't cost you anything more than time. No parts were replaced, only cleaned. I wonder if I am exposing a trade secret that mechanics use to charge their customers for unneeded parts, and while there, the mechanic also cleans a clogged condensate line. Have a nice day. I am a now retired Gas Fitter and Gas Appliance Repairman. I make a good many efforts to help people get their equipment repaired every day, and help people identify incompetent repairman who are wasting their money. At no charge. My experience is that this becomes difficult to do when people stack one problem on top of another. You may imagine that has advantages ----from my perspective as a skilled repairman, it does not. If you or others wish to persist in that approach though, you are certainly welcome to do so. I generally just ignore such threads if people want to go that way. My York diamond 90 also had the same issues of blowing cold air and the code of 4 red lights flashing, turned out to be the main blower motor went bad- I suspected that was the cause as I noticed the motor was making light popping noises a week prior to the actual problem occurring. replaced the original motor, which is an A.O. Smith F48P23A50 1/3 hp. 4 speed with a universal type replacement motor that requires a clamp on band (Mars 08049) to match the orig. type mounting. the new motor is also an A.O. Smith, DL 1036 1/3 hp three speed. got a new capacitor as well, a Packard POC5. If you do-it-yourself make sure to record were all the wires go before disconnecting any. (and of course- the POWER OFF.) This is not to say that what worked for me is the same problem with other furnaces with similar type issues- it did happen to get me going again though. Hello 77889900 , Your post illustrates why it's usually a waste of time or worse for people to revive old threads because they think they see a similar issue with their own furnace problems. Usually they are just guessing, and experience shows that such guesses are a waste of time. Similar symptoms can often be caused by a variety of different problems. Furthermore, it becomes hard for someone trying to provide help to keep different problem separate ---which can even be dangerous when what is happening or been checked out becomes hard to track. So the smart move is for people with a furnace problem to start a new thread and get help diagnosing the actual problem that may be causing them a problem.
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